Tool Librarys

[Snipes44]

Hello,

I have really just dove in to CamBam over that last week and I'm really like it so far. One question I have is the tool library and how others are using it. I have done some of my own testing trying to figure out how it works and just want to make sure that I fully understand it.

The tool library needs to be filled out with the tools you plan to use which I get. What is puzzling me at the moment is what do you do when you have a bunch of different drills between different jobs and you don't want to have 135 drill sizes (tool numbers) in you library?

I typically like to set my jobs up with T1 being the 1st tool that is ran T2 next and so on. Well the tools are not the same for each job.

The way I understand the tool library is it is more of a "master list" and your tool numbers must always be the same.

I would only have 5-6 tools that will always be the same. Face mills, spot drill, probe and plan to keep these with the same tool number between all jobs. But all the other tools I plan to have different tool numbers to match up with order that they are ran in.

I don't want to have a tool library for every single job that would just be another file that I would have to keep track of and managing all of that would be a pita.

Also from my understanding if I have few programs (CB file) that use the same tool library and I change one of the tools in the library (say I change a 1/2 EM to an 3/8 EM) that change well be applied over all the program files that use that tool number?

I will be running these parts on an old Hurco KMB1 that I have retrofitted with Mach3. Manual tool changes.

I'm trying to get this setup as close to work as possible. I don't need to have another method to remember.

FYI I use MasterCam X5 at work.

How are you guys managing you tool library?

[10bulls]

When I was initially developing the tool library system, I had another object 'Tool Palette'; so you would define your tools in your library, then include them in a palette.
Tools could be in multiple palettes with different tool numbers in each.
Although flexible, I found this added an extra layer of complication which in many cases was not needed.

The suggested alternative working method then became...

Define your tools in your master tool library (or libraries).

Create extra tool libraries to function as palettes.

Copy and paste tools from your master libraries into your palettes.
Where possible they will retain the tool number from the master library, but this may change if there are duplicates.
You can also change the tool number in the 'palette' library if needed, to reflect the order of tool use for example; The Part Code property could perhaps be used to store the reference to the original master tool library number.

In your CamBam drawings, under the 'Machining' options (or 'Part' options), you can then set the 'Tool Library' property to the 'palette' you wish to use.
Then all the tool numbers in the drawing will refer to that palette library.

The main downside to this method is; if you change tool parameters in your master library, you need to remember to delete and recopy the tool into any palettes that use it.  But the positive flip side of this is the palette will contain a snapshot of the tool parameters you used to generate a job (until you re-copy the tools).

Maintaining tool lists, particularly across multiple different programs, can be a tedious business and one I think could greatly benefit from scripting or plugins.  I will work on producing some example scripts as a starting point for anyone who would find this useful.

I don't want to have a tool library for every single job...

I am not sure if the method I described would lead to this... if you wanted to keep the tool numbering in the order they were used it might.
I tend to think of my palettes as specific to a 'type of job', so I have palettes for 'steel on the mill', 'PCB routing', '3D work' etc.

The tool library needs to be filled out with the tools you plan to use...

Not necessarily.
Many users find it adequate just to enter a tool diameter (or tool profile) directly into a machining operation, without the need for libraries.  This can also be used to 'override' any settings from the tool library for a given tool number.

It would be interesting to hear about user's experiences working with the tool library.
The tool library system will be due some work in the next major release so any feedback, suggestions for improvements is very welcome.

[Bob La Londe]

As mentioned I am one of those who just enters tool information into the machining properties for each MOP.  That being said, I find that I am probably wasting a lot of time with this now that I have a good idea what they will and won't do on my current machines more of the time.  I need to start learning how to use the rool library so I can just plug in a tool number and move one. 

[gpw]

I find the tool library invaluable.

My machines store tool information, diameter and Z offset, in the controller. When I need a tool it gets installed in a tool holder, assigned a number, and the diameter and offset info stored in the machine controller by that number. Then the tool number and description are entered into the CamBam library. Each tool gets it's own holder then cataloged as mentioned and placed in a tool rack. When I create a part program in CamBam all I have to do is select the tool number for the particular MOP. When I start machining, all I do is select the required tools by number from the rack and place them in a smaller rack at the machine. When the machine controller sees a tool change it goes to the tool change position, displays the tool number on the screen, and all I do is remove the existing tool from the spindle and plug the required tool in the spindle and go, as the controller already knows the offset info from the tool number. It works about the same as having an automatic tool changer, but it's not automated, I get to stand there and do it!

Drills and taps don't get set up permanently in tool holders, they get set up and indexed for the specific job.

[skray775]

I use the tool Library to define tools in the same way they are listed in my machine controller tool table numbered 000 - 250.  See picture.

Notice some empty spaces... I reserve 4 spaces for each size above 1/6".  This will allow for a variety tool types like the number of flutes,length, rougher, finishers etc. 

I then use Styles to define the speeds and feeds etc. for those tools in different materials or situations. I reference the tool number in the style name. The styles are adjusted over time as I gain experience with feeds, speeds, depth of cut, etc.

So if I had a two styles for tool #030 (2 flute 1/4" endmill) one to do pockets and another style for deep slots they would use the same tool number in the style name like this.

030 - EM - 1/4" 2F - HSS - Pocket
030 - EM - 1/4" 2F - HSS - Slot

Tool 031 is a 3 flute 1/4" and would be

031 - EM 1/4" 3F - HSS

This makes it easy to find the style that matches your tools.  If you are looking for a 1/4" 2 flute style just scroll down to the 030 section and all your styles are in one place.  I also have the materials broken into different folders but you could use the method above like this without folders for materials

030 - EM - 1/4" 2F - HSS - Aluminum 6061
030 - EM - 1/4" 2F - HSS - Wood MDF
030 - EM - 1/4" 2F - HSS - Plastic

I hope that helps

[Snipes44]

Thanks for the replies, lots of good info here.

Bob La Londe - The method that you are using is how I use to do it. When I started my current job that was the way the did it also for the most part. Since I have been there we have been building the tool library and it saves so much time.

gpw - Sounds like you have some what of a production shop? The method you describe is similar to a production shop that I use to work for. We had karts with tools in holders that where only used for each job. With my hobby shop, plus my mill using Kwik Switch 200 holders I don't have a lot of holders to play with. I do plan to have my face mills, probe and spot drill in designated holders. End mills and drills I will need to switch out between holders depending on the job. Most of the work that I will be doing well be one offs.

Kregan - Thanks for the great explanation on how you set it up. Looks like that is the method I well try to copy. I have tool numbers from 0-253 on my control. Only question I would have is what do you do about drills? I don't imagine that you have every drill size in you library. If you do I would guess that you only have the drill size and not the length/style.

10bulls - First of nice piece of software. The method you described I would think for me that would lead to having a library for every job. What I don't like is the fact that if you change a tool in the "master" library that is going to change the tool in each program that uses that tool number when you load that program again (assuming that I'm understanding libraries correctly). I can see from a production shop point of view how this could work out great. From a hobby shop not seeing how this is an advantage. Once I get a program up and running I don't wan the change of over writing something when I load the program to make a small change.

Suggests I have so far on the libraries. The main one would be to have an option that is similar to your pallet option but instead of having another file/config/library to manage, incorporate the pallet in to the CB file. You end up with a tool list/library that is specific to that job file only. Keeps your library folder from having a bunch of libraries. When you start a new job you select your tools and copy them from the master library to your job file. Here you can change numbers feeds/speeds etc that only effect that job and not the master library.

After reading back through my replies it looks like I need to pick one method instead of combining two. Going to have to think about this one for a bit.

My main reason for trying to get this setup is only want to do this once. I have seen so much wasted time at my current job in doing the "to get by" method and then later wanting to change that to a more ordered method. Especially when we go back to old programs and have to update them to the new standards. Some times its just easier to delete it and start over. A lot of our parts have gone from prototype to production. The prototype parts in the past were made "any means necessary". We are paying for it now.


Thanks again for the great replies.

[skray775]

I have 006-012 reserved for drills.  I only have 3 chucks at the moment and just use those.  I install whatever size I need and adjust the length in the tool table at the machine.

[10bulls]

Thanks for these interesting replies, they will certainly be useful when contemplating the next tool library changes.

What I don't like is the fact that if you change a tool in the "master" library that is going to change the tool in each program that uses that tool number when you load that program again (assuming that I'm understanding libraries correctly).

If the machining operation's Tool Diameter or Tool Profile property is marked as 'Default' (ie, shown with a grey left arrow) and you have a Tool Number set, so the diameter and profile is read from the tool library;
If the tool library values change, the next time the machining operation checks it's default values (when it is selected or toolpaths generated), this should trigger the 'Property Cache Conflict' dialog.
This is a very ugly title I will admit  , but the intention is to bring it to your attention that a previously used default value has changed since it was last used.
If 'Use old value' is selected here, the property will change from a default, to an explicit value.
The current default values are always stored in the drawing, so the same parameters are preserved and can be used even if the system libraries have changed since the document was saved... or if the drawing is sent to someone else who may have different library settings.

Having a tool palette/library within the drawing could be a good idea.
Perhaps this would appear as a new folder [Tools] underneath the Machining folder.
So when looking for a tool number, it would look first in the drawing's tools, and then in the Machining/Part Tool Libraries, default tool libraries etc.

[10bulls]

I have just uploaded an example Python script that may help with tool library maintenance...

http://www.cambam.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=2913.0

[skray775]

Fantastic!  Can't wait to try this out.

[Snipes44]

Having a tool palette/library within the drawing could be a good idea. Perhaps this would appear as a new folder [Tools] underneath the Machining folder. So when looking for a tool number, it would look first in the drawing's tools, and then in the Machining/Part Tool Libraries, default tool libraries etc.

This sounds to me great!